Wednesday, August 28, 2013

Abortion and Psychosis, some clarification on my part

Below is a direct copy past from an email exchange with a friend.

From: FRIENDTo: KELLY
Subject: RE: Grey Area Sticky Abortion Question
Date: Tue, 27 Aug 2013 20:28:41 +0800
Hey there Kelly,

Good on you for looking out for this girl, I’m sure she appreciates your support and listening ear right now.
 There were many questions that came to me while I was reading this scenario (see my red below). Ultimately, I think this girl needs professional help in two areas. One area is ethical advice, which really ought to go to someone more experienced and qualified. I think bioethics in the Archdiocese is Fr Joe Parkinson’s responsibility? Bronia at the RLO could also advise you on who could help. I’d recommend you get in touch with either of these asap.
 The other area of professional help this girl needs is counselling with regards to coming to terms with her pregnancy. I think she may be thinking that abortion is the least bad of the options she is facing. Pregnancy Assistance might be able to help. Bronia at the RLO might also be able to advise you what to do on this. This girl may also need counselling in general for just being in this complicated situation.
 How does this sit with you?
 I’ll keep this matter in my prayers.
 God bless,
FRIEND
  
I've a friend, whom I met in hospital, who is allergic to oestrogen. Which is unfortunate because she has XX Chromosomes, as I do. Her reaction to estrogen day to day is severe depressive episodes.
We met in hospital because she'd started taking oestrogen based contraception and it had triggered a suicidal psychosis. If her fiance hadn't unexpectedly come home two hours early to find her unusually calm, she would be dead. That was around 2x her normal day-to-day levels.

This friend is now worried that she's pregnant. Oestrogen levels by the end of pregnancy are, apparently, about 1000x that of day-to-day levels. She's extremely resourceful and, during her psychoses, can be very deceptive about how bad things actually are. At anything more that 2x her normal levels of oestrogen, she will find a way to kill herself. If she is pregnant then wont her oestrogen levels have already risen significantly? They go up relatively quick I thought.

The Church teaches, through the principle of double effect, that she can continue and increase treatment for her mental illness during pregnancy, even to the detriment of the child. Sounds like the principle of double effect, but before definitively concluding on this difficult situation I’d get another opinion from someone more experienced in ethics. Has this girl already seen an ethicist at the hospital? She could take some oestrogen-blocking therapy, even if it kills the child.

The child could, however, survive to or past around 20 weeks when both pain and viability-outside-the-womb become a possibility I’m not sure if you could block oestrogen AND get to 20 weeks pregnant – more likely to miscarry early in the pregnancy if the hormones are not at healthy levels? If the child is born, at whatever stage after that, there is a high likelihood of terrible suffering for them. It is unlikely that the child will survive long after birth, if at all. What does she mean by that? Is it a health issue or something else… 

She could, of course, not continue or receive more treatment. That decision would depend on her mental health doctors wouldn’t it? I don’t know a lot about her psychotic-suicidal reaction to oestrogen. What if she just went under 24hr surveillance? Her husband could take leave and care for her?

Meanwhile, even a week of high levels of estrogen - much more for if it's 40 weeks - and this friend is likely dead; almost certainly.

Her question to me: How is killing the embryo, foetus, child slowly, possible over 9 or 10 months, more ethical than a direct abortion? My intention in either case is to stop in estrogen and the result in either case is the thing dying?
I’m not sure how the child could die slowly over 9 or 10 months. If she blocks the oestrogen then I can’t see how she could bring the child to full term.
If the child was born, is this girl thinking of killing the child?
I appreciate her lose-lose situation, but we both know abortion leads to further suffering.
She needs counselling with regard to her difficult situation. Pregnancy Assistance?

My question to you: How should I answer?


EDIT to clarify:
 I use allergy somewhat allegorically.
She has BPD and has a psychotic-suicidal reaction to estrogen. 
My assumptions, the 'givens,' are based on my close knowledge of her and her condition.
Also, yes, she could continue with BPD therapy; the resulting death or injuries to the child are of the same likelihood.
And, she uses a utilitarian prism for her moral compass:
"Greatest good for the greatest number," while believing that "There is some suffering worse than death."
*   ***   ***   ***   *
From: KELLY
Sent: Tuesday, 27 August 2013 10:30 PM
To: FRIEND
Subject: RE: Grey Area Sticky Abortion Question

Thank you, FRIEND. You raise some great questions.
I've been in contact with both RLO and PA.
I'm hoping to hear back from both tomorrow.
Alas, this woman is suspicious of anyone clearly on either 'side' of the 'abortion fence,' so to speak.
This means that the likelihood of her speaking to someone other than me or Fr Giles (whom she met while we were in hospital) is quite low.
Now, to your questions:
If she is pregnant then wont her oestrogen levels have already risen significantly? They go up relatively quick I thought.Yes. That's why she's worried that she's pregnant. It's been about a week and she's noticed a huge increase in her depression and the first symptoms of psychosis.
Sounds like the principle of double effect, but before definitively concluding on this difficult situation I’d get another opinion from someone more experienced in ethics. Has this girl already seen an ethicist at the hospital?This is part of my reason for contacting RLO.
Although we probably could have asked to have seen an ethicist in hospital, it's not really high on a mental-health patients list-of-professionals-to-see.
  I’m not sure if you could block oestrogen AND get to 20 weeks pregnant – more likely to miscarry early in the pregnancy if the hormones are not at healthy levels?Probably can't.
But she also has the option of continuing her current medication without taking the oestrogen blocker-thing which would severely harm the child.
What does she mean by that? Is it a health issue or something else… Health of the child in regard to the effects of the medication/s she'd be taking during pregnancy.
 That decision would depend on her mental health doctors wouldn’t it? I don’t know a lot about her psychotic-suicidal reaction to oestrogen. What if she just went under 24hr surveillance? Her husband could take leave and care for her?  Well, kind of. Under the Mental Health Act, you have the right to refuse treatment.
The only type of supervision that might work is being in a Locked Ward for the duration of the oestrogen spike.
She'd probably have to be literally tied down: it's the curse of being a high functioning mental health patient that, once you've decided that you need to die, nothing but physically preventing you from acting will stop you. 
 I’m not sure how the child could die slowly over 9 or 10 months. If she blocks the oestrogen then I can’t see how she could bring the child to full term.If the child was born, is this girl thinking of killing the child?I appreciate her lose-lose situation, but we both know abortion leads to further suffering. She needs counselling with regard to her difficult situation. Pregnancy Assistance?
 As above, probably not. 9 months in the womb, maybe a month outside.She has not intention of killing a live-born child.It does, but so does several months of phychosis. 
I will continue trying to chase (up or down) any help I can get for her.
 Thank you, again, for your help and - more especially - for your prayers.
 You remain in my prayers, too.
 -Kelly

Tuesday, August 27, 2013

Abortion and Psychosis, A question

I've a friend, whom I met in hospital, who is allergic to oestrogen. Which is unfortunate because she has XX Chromosomes, as I do. Her reaction to estrogen day to day is severe depressive episodes.
We met in hospital because she'd started taking oestrogen based contraception and it had triggered a suicidal psychosis. If her fiance hadn't unexpectedly come home two hours early to find her unusually calm, she would be dead. That was around 2x her normal day-to-day levels.

This friend is now worried that she's pregnant. Oestrogen levels by the end of pregnancy are, apparently, about 1000x that of day-to-day levels. She's extremely resourceful and, during her psychoses, can be very deceptive about how bad things actually are. At anything more that 2x her normal levels of oestrogen, she will find a way to kill herself.

The Church teaches, through the principle of double effect, that she can continue and increase treatment for her mental illness during pregnancy, even to the detriment of the child. She could take some oestrogen-blocking therapy, even if it kills the child.
The child could, however, survive to or past around 20 weeks when both pain and viability-outside-the-womb become a possibility. If the child is born, at whatever stage after that, there is a high likelihood of terrible suffering for them. It is unlikely that the child will survive long after birth, if at all.

She could, of course, not continue or receive more treatment.

Meanwhile, even a week of high levels of estrogen - much more for if it's 40 weeks - and this friend is likely dead; almost certainly.

Her question to me: How is killing the embryo, foetus, child slowly, possible over 9 or 10 months, more ethical than a direct abortion? My intention in either case is to stop in estrogen and the result in either case is the thing dying?

My question to you: How should I answer?



EDIT to clarify:
 I use allergy somewhat allegorically.
She has BPD and has a psychotic-suicidal reaction to estrogen. 
My assumptions, the 'givens,' are based on my close knowledge of her and her condition.
Also, yes, she could continue with BPD therapy; the resulting death or injuries to the child are of the same likelihood.
And, she uses a utilitarian prism for her moral compass:
"Greatest good for the greatest number," while believing that "There is some suffering worse than death."

Friday, August 23, 2013

Poetry Post: The World State by G K Chesterton


Oh, how I love Humanity
With love so pure and pringlish,
And how I hate the horrid French,
Who never will be English!

The International Idea,
The largest and the clearest,
Is welding all the nations now,
Except the one that’s nearest.

This compromise has long been known,
This scheme of partial pardons,
In ethical societies
And small suburban gardens—

The villas and the chapels where
I learned with little labour
The way to love my fellow-man
And to hate my next-door neighbor.

G.K. Chesterton

Monday, August 19, 2013

De Eucharistae

Even what we have come to call 'the words of institution' are absent from some early Eucharistic settings.
Sr Patricia Smith RSM, Teaching Sacraments

The short answer to Tyson's question, "is this true?" appears to be no.

Long post re: your question this morning.

So, from what I can see, " Ambrose says (De Sacram. iv): "The consecration is accomplished by the words and expressions of the Lord Jesus. [...] the form of this sacrament implies merely the consecration of the matter, which consists in transubstantiation, as when it is said, "This is My body," or, "This is the chalice of My blood." " (ST IV q78 a1)
Not 'Words of Consecration;' no Consecration.

As for the old Liturgies not having that:
Liturgy of St Mark:
"The Priest (aloud): For this is my body, which is broken for you, and divided for the remission of sins.
The People: Amen.
[...]
The Priest (aloud): For this is my blood of the new testament which is shed for you and for many, and distributed among you for the remission of sins.
The People: Amen."

Liturgy of St James:
"Then he says aloud:— Take, eat: this is my body, broken for you, and given for remission of sins.
The People: Amen.
Then he takes the cup, and says:— In like manner, after supper, He took the cup, and having mixed wine and water, lifting up His eyes to heaven, and presenting it to You, His God and Father, He gave thanks, and hollowed and blessed it, and filled it with the Holy Spirit, and gave it to us His disciples, saying, Drink all of it; this is my blood of the new testament shed for you and many, and distributed for the remission of sins.
The People: Amen."

Also, from the Apostolic Constitutions, Book VIII
"Being mindful, therefore, of those things that He endured for our sakes, we give You thanks, O God Almighty, not in such a manner as we ought, but as we are able, and fulfil His constitution: For in the same night that He was betrayed, He took bread (1 Corinthians 11:23) in His holy and undefiled hands, and, looking up to You His God and Father, He broke it, and gave it to His disciples, saying, This is the mystery of the new covenant: take of it, and eat. This is my body, which is broken for many, for the remission of sins. In like manner also He took the cup, and mixed it of wine and water, and sanctified it, and delivered it to them, saying: Drink all of this; for this is my blood which is shed for many, for the remission of sins: do this in remembrance of me. For as often as you eat this bread and drink this cup, you do show forth my death until I come. "

The only thing I can think of is that perhaps Sister means that it wasn't mentioned in St John's Gospel?


***

Saturday, August 17, 2013

Coping with Suicide: Quetiapine



Of late, my thoughts have been racing a bunch, so my doctor proscribed me some quetiapine to help quiet the thoughts.
Most of my thoughts-sans-quetiapine have ended up similar to Dave the barbarian's.